We would terminate the pregnancy. To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account. You get extra care and monitoring as appropriate and baby is proactively treated. The chances that anything bad will be discovered are v v small. And at the end of the day however much we talked about it - that it was going to be the two of us to make the decision and me to actually you know, go through it and decide that that was what was going to happen for him - and I just, I didn't want to do it. Although the anomaly scan is often called a 20-week scan, you may have it any time between 18 and 22 weeks, although it's usually done between 18 and 20 weeks. I thought I was going to burst into tears. Most scans show that babies seem to be developing as expected, and none of the 11 conditions are found. Others, including those who had been given leaflets to read about the scan beforehand as well as some who were health professionals, said that they had been nave about the 20-week scan. You may like someone to come with you to the scan appointment. Sam reassured me, but the guilt had hit me along with the feeling that our world was falling apart. Sometimes doctors will wait to give the baby more time to develop and carry out repeat scans - this had confused several parents we talked to who had gone for repeat scans not knowing that the baby might have a problem. And even at that early stage it was beginning to sink in that there was something really not right. Nice people shouldn't hear about what we'd done. Where we have identified any third party copyright information you will need to obtain permission from the copyright holders concerned. But I was struggling mentally with the anguish, grief and endless hospital visits. He wanted to talk about it, but I didn't. Some things can be seen more clearly than others. So instead, I was advised to go home and let nature take its course. So we decided that, to have the scan and we went along I think early in the week for that, and spent quite a lot of time with the consultant after that. I want to stop having such horrible thoughts. We both thought we would like some good to come out of this horrible experience, so wanted to talk to somebody about the possibility of using the body for research purposes. The sonographer will be able to tell you the results of the scan at the time. The baby kicked, blissfully unaware of what I had done. This article was amended on 24 November 2015 to anonymise the writer. If necessary, you will be referred to a specialist, possibly in another hospital. Some people want to find out if their baby has one of the 11 conditions and some do not. And I can just remember flashing a look at you as if to say, 'Have I made a mistake here somewhere? And, faced with feeling sorry for myself or feeling sorry for my child, I know which I'd choose. At the time the same thing had, exactly the same thing had happened to my friend a month before, and her scan was absolutely fine. As I say, I'm not a very nice person at the moment. You will then be asked to raise your top to your chest and lower your skirt or trousers to your hips. That he - I think I was 21 weeks and 3 days, and he was coming up at 19 weeks and 4 days, or something like that. 18-20 week scans provide clinicians with more information than earlier scans because by18 weeks a healthy baby should be larger and better developed. Those two weeks were agonising for us both. DS had 2 soft markers: talipes (club foot) and 'echogenic locii' somewhere - heart I think. News stories, speeches, letters and notices, Reports, analysis and official statistics, Data, Freedom of Information releases and corporate reports. Emma was 20 weeks' pregnant when a routine scan revealed that the baby she was expecting had Down's syndrome and heart problems. However, a few hours later there was another shift change. We also use cookies set by other sites to help us deliver content from their services. The 18 -20 week fetal anomaly scan is a watershed in most pregnancies because for the majority of women it will be the last time they are scanned before giving birth. It was over. Having the scan does not hurt but the sonographer may need to apply slight pressure to get the best views of your baby. Rather sharply, my partner tried to explain. What happens at the second midwife appointment? It was all going wrong and I wanted to get as far away from the hospital as possible. Why me and not you, you bastard? It was interesting - well it was fantastic to see this fetus and to see this child that was yours that was horribly ill - but you didn't really get much opportunity to see that because the consultant was more about measurements and all sorts of blood flow and various other screens coming up. To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account. At this point it wasn't looking great. Still, the consultant thought things would be OK. So we gave up and said we'd arrange the funeral ourselves. You have accepted additional cookies. Several women had taken young children with them to the 20-week scan because they expected to see 'nice pictures of the baby'. 'Soft markers'. And it was just a bit of a shock because it's not really what you want to hear - you don't really expect that. Tissue paper will be tucked around your clothing to protect it from the ultrasound gel, which will then be put on your tummy. Baby loss support Tommys is a registered charity in England and Wales (1060508) and Scotland (SC039280). All the time, the baby was kicking and I felt like a murderer waiting to strike her victim. I think they perhaps could have done, if they had looked a bit closely. Dont worry we wont send you spam or share your email address with anyone. And I could see, before she even said anything I could see that there was something wrong with the heart. I wasn't ready to make a decision straight away, and I was told I could call them in the morning. But even if I was there, I still think I would have wanted to see the detail on the scan. I mean, you just, you're just overwhelmed, it's so much fun. I had an appointment with my consultant 2 days later, and again he said, you know, 'Very common - shouldn't worry about it too much, you know, if, the problem is if they find anything else wrong'. The consultant had said it wouldn't be like a normal delivery. Our week-by-week PREGNANCY emails are a must for parents-to-be. And it's, I can't remember exactly what it was now, it's about where the brain is supposed to form. I had never imagined having an amniocentesis. No sort of questions about, 'Do you want to know whether it's a boy or a girl?' When I see a child with Down's syndrome, I have a tremendous need to explain myself and apologise a million times over. It would be a personal tragedy for my partner and me, but that is all. When I think about how long it took them to deliberate ultimately, maybe not, but it just felt like a bit of a fast food situation, didn't it? And they, sort of two of them were looking at the scan machine and then they sort of switched everything off and said, 'Oh, I think we have, might have a problem'. She just said, 'It's a bit short, it needs to be checked' again basically. So on the Monday we went in to see the senior sonographer, I think she was a consultant at the hospital. Several parents said they would have preferred being told something, even it was vague. And I said, I was still laughing, and I thought he was joking with me, and he said now I sort of could tell from his face that by that point he wasn't really joking anymore. So at least then we went to that next stage prepared for the worst really. I think the whole experience has made me a pretty nasty person. I was becoming numb to the whole process. The doctor or midwife looking after you will let you know before you come. In fact, interestingly enough, going sort of. Looked exactly like our two year old as a baby. And, for a few hours, I'm convinced I've made a terrible mistake. You've had, you've had your Down's Syndrome check and that's okay. Sometimes a post mortem was needed to confirm the 20-week diagnosis to see if the baby had inherited a genetic problem (such as Fowler syndrome - see 'Resources'). I was told that while bad news at the 12 w scan is often of the life or death kind, bad news at the 20 week scan is often of the 'needs an operation in childhood' or 'needs to wear a brace for a year' kind. It was another consultant, who said, "I'm afraid I have some bad news - your baby has Down's syndrome." We decided that we wanted medication to help me. The doctor explained the options I had to manage my miscarriage. The blood test confirmed it was twins. As you felt that, you know, it was probably going to show lots of problems and it just wasn't what we wanted, but at the same time we needed to sort of see it and, we needed to prove it I suppose. A black and white picture of your baby will then be seen on the ultrasound screen. I should stop being dramatic and pessimistic. I know it is still early days. We need to have your opinion'. 2022. I felt empty, scared, guilty and incredibly heartbroken. Some people we talked to had not had a 18-20-week scan, either because their babies' abnormalities had been detected by earlier . We had so much power, we could decide that this little thing should die. The 18-20 week antenatal scan and further tests. You know there's always that bit on the bottom of the thing, 'These are diagnostics, do not bring other children,' - blah, blah, blah.. it's not, you know, it's not a family outing kind of thing, but it feels like it. To view this licence, visit nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3 or write to the Information Policy Team, The National Archives, Kew, London TW9 4DU, or email: psi@nationalarchives.gov.uk. For five months my body had known there was something wrong, yet I had felt fantastic. It doesn't remove the guilt, but I don't know what else to do. This image shows a baby's face and hands at 20 weeks, and gives you an idea of what you'll be able to see at this scan. I couldn't work out what was taking so long and put it down to the doctor being young and inexperienced. I then had to wait in the room along with many other patients for an hour so they could observe me. So I suppose from that aspect, mind you having not been told that or sitting there, I wouldn't have thought necessarily that was odd. Specialist scans had a powerful effect on some parents because they could see the baby more clearly and in some cases people recognised which parts of the baby's body were not working properly. In the case of a suspected abnormality, women should be seen for a second opinion by an expert in fetal ultrasound, such as a fetal medicine specialist. And I couldn't escape the feeling that I was being selfish. But worse was to come. And still we asked to see a, Impact of the 20-week and later specialist scans. unfortunately the 20 week anomaly scan can pick up serious issues, hearing heart beats at midwife appointment doesn't let us know what's going on inside the body in detail. Instead, I had to raise a glass of water to my mouth, take a swig and swallow the tablet. Purpose of screening. And that was scanning up from the above the head, then you were coming up through the child's head, so you were seeing the chambers in the brain, sort of it was evident in all four chambers of the brain, then suddenly one chamber was empty. We saw the consultant, who was reassuring, saying that he would rescan me and was sure everything would be fine. She endured many agonising rounds of scans and tests, and unfortunately met with some unhelpful attitudes from some healthcare professionals. I had no idea if we were doing the "right" thing. The same rush of excitement. The doctor wanted to do another blood test to confirm a significant drop in my hormone levels. The following is a quote from their report: If the scan reveals either a suspected or confirmed abnormality, the woman should be informed by the sonographer at the time of the scan. Eventually, the midwife said to us very sweetly, "I think we should deliver the baby now." So we left it there, and we didn't actually think that there was anything really to worry about after that scan. But it's bloody hard being miserable the whole time. Some hospitals do offer earlier anomaly scans of the baby, but they will not show as much detail as scans performed between 18 and 20weeks. You will be able to discuss this with your midwife or consultant. The milk came and stayed for what seemed like for ever. Because we knew that that wasn't normal, that wasn't what we'd experienced before, it wasn't just the, 'There's the arm, there's the leg, oh look the baby's moving'. He had to come to the decision by himself. Anyway we went in for the meeting with the consultant on this particular time, and we'd got to, I was 30 weeks pregnant by then. It is also sometimes referred to as the mid-pregnancy scan. My partner spent the weekend trying to convince me that things were OK. And then all of a sudden, I was still laughing and we were all very upbeat, and then suddenly, he suddenly said, but I was still, still laughing, and he said to me, 'Oh, there might be a problem, there might be a problem with the, I think this baby has hydrocephalus'. The consultant explained that this was just very bad luck and not, as far as they knew, genetic. Health professionals use the 18-20 week scan to examine the baby's size and position, and also to check if his/her brain, heart, lungs and other internal organs are developing as expected. Being deeply unhappy and kind to others at the same time is nigh on impossible. I just feel very unlucky. Check benefits and financial support you can get, Find out about the Energy Bills Support Scheme, NHS fetal anomaly screening programme (FASP), Screening tests for you and your baby (STFYAYB), nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3, more information and details of support groups. I wanted to let nature take its course. And the doctor - because it was a doctor rather then just the, a sonographer or whatever the correct term is - was scanning my wife, and she hovered over the heart of the baby and said, 'Oh there's the heart, we'll come back to that'. I endured 12 hours of medication and in the early hours February 7, 56 days after my first scan (at nearly 18 weeks), I miscarried our babies. Wishing to be anywhere, but here being told the same agonising truth over and over again. But he was not sure. By this time, we were tired. Most scans are carried out by specially trained staff called sonographers. My partner really wanted me to, and by that time I had no sense of what was right or what I should do. There, I would give birth. And that was extraordinary to see the detail that that could offer. Try to relax and take it easy. And they actually asked my husband to come in before they spoke to me. Read full disclaimer. And shortly after that, that scan we'd finished and the consultant leant back and said, 'I'm afraid we have some problems here'. Cardiac surgery can do some amazing things. I came back probably about 17 weeks pregnant and had the anomaly scan at 20 weeks and like most people expected everything to be fine and to come away with a lovely picture but unfortunately that isn't what happened. Then, three days later, I would go to the labour ward - the ward I had been expecting to visit in two and a half months. It would have been nice to see someone straight away because I was in such shock. It felt so wrong. We couldn't say we'd lost the baby, because he was still kicking away, but we couldn't pretend everything was fine, either. Has anyone been told the sex incorrectly at their 20 week scan? And I thought that if I were faced with the possibility of having an amnio, hours of discussion would follow - I would spend days mulling it over. She wanted to have a look at the skull, which was the main thing, but she couldn't see it from where the baby was. I still feel guilty, I still cry at random times. But my brain had been given a train of thought that was impossible to stop. He told me that they may want to do blood tests, but that 'he didn't see the point'. Let a mum know you're thinking of them send one of our personalised Mother's Day cards today, Home I had to take a tablet there and then, under the supervision of a nurse, to end the pregnancy. Again the legs were quite twisted, they said that the baby's sternum was very short - things weren't in proportion you know - the head was quite large, the neck was very thick, there wasn't really like a neck as such it was just things were kind of - there were lots of things that obviously the consultant could see that we weren't aware of. But I still didn't want to be the one who stopped this baby's chance to live. Within two days I was waiting in my local EPU unit for further tests. We'd sort of put those discussions to the back of our mind, and then all of a sudden there are other abnormalities so yeah it was a bit a bit of a shocker [laughs]. After half an hour of lying on the bed, I was starting to get nervous, but was excited to find out that the baby would be a boy and that I could see his little heart beating strongly. And my husband, we never got to sit next to each other in the consulting room, my husband was across the room from me, and I was sat next to the consultant, and we were laughing and joking with him about, you know, the home delivery, and everything was going to be, 'Are you still on for the home delivery?' And she said that, you know, as the, if the baby did develop further there would probably be other problems with internal organs that weren't really that visible at that stage. As though I went power mad for a week, killing my innocent unborn child, and now I am tainted for ever. For once in my life, I had been organised. I ran into the bedroom to tell Sam, who was ecstatic. But he was wrong. A long process of blood tests, scans, doctors and hospitals. He suggested he perform an amniocentesis immediately, to rule out any chromosomal problems. I was willing the results to be normal. How common is it for 2nd baby to come early..? After preparing myself to face having to take the medication. My partner tried to remain calm, and at my request rang my mum. An appointment should be arranged as soon as possible and ideally within three working days. I was becoming numb to the whole process. That's fine. I let out an animal scream and [wife] kind of leapt onto me on the bed. Maybe our son would have overcome his problems, survived his illnesses, led a happy life. We had the same conversation, but obviously were not making any sense to her at all. You're in and out and that was it. 17/12/2020 17:13. Actually you could tell from the brain development as he scanned up through the chambers of the brain, that one quarter of the brain, one chamber was not evident. But no. Immediately I knew what decision we should take. I loved him instantly and didn't want to let him go. This is not what I imagined pregnancy to feel like', Baby Loss Awareness Week - Voice Five - Bryony Seabrook. So it was, there was very, very little movement from the baby because I remembered first time round by that stage, you know, that the baby was quite big and it moved around a lot at a later scan. Thick milky discharge at 14 weeks.tmi pic attached. We went in, had a scan, I can't remember the exact sequence of events because the baby was still in the wrong position. This does not mean there is anything to worry about. Sam followed and I broke down. I travelled to work that day feeling amazing. As I left the room to compose myself. I believed at this point I had miscarried, they wanted me to come back I'm for a follow up scan. I couldn't bear to see the baby and asked the midwife to take him away immediately. We thought it would all be over very quickly but, in fact, it was another 11 hours before the baby was delivered. The scan looks for 11 different conditions in your baby and cannot find everything that might be wrong. As I lay down, and the sonographer started, I could see there was something wrong. Seated in the antenatal clinic with lots of expectant mothers with baby bumps. It was real. See more information about the 20-week ultrasound scan. Saturday came. No, we really didn't, with hindsight we probably should have, but not at all, it never occurred to us to be worried about it. We had the baby cremated. Good luck has not come easily over the past few years. We had the 20 week scan yesterday and got some devastating news. And at that point I don't think we, I don't think we realised that there might have to be a decision, because we'd talked about it with, with Down's and the other possible problems, but at this point it was, well okay what can be done to fix the problem - because yes the heart's not developing properly but there must be something we can do. And so this one can't tell you anything, it's pictures, you're going, you're going to see your baby, you're going to get pictures. Maybe. We use some essential cookies to make this website work. It was just sort of deadpan faces, very serious looks, someone else coming to check. So we'd gone through the Down's syndrome or worse scare, we'd had conversations about what we would do, if it was confirmed that it was Down's syndrome or another syndrome, another sort of chromosome abnormality. No, you couldn't see there was anything wrong. I can feel my child kick, it responds when he shouts at football - I mean literally, this baby used to dance around whenever he'd like scream at a goal - and there cannot be anything wrong with this child because it's part of us already. There was a very marked lack of amniotic fluid which made it difficult, not even for the scanners to see, that made the picture of the scan look very, very different. blood tests, CVS) were clear - and as one woman put it, 'after the triple test* (Down's syndrome screening) you stop thinking anything can go wrong'. No one else attended and we didn't have a service. Thinking back, I don't know how we left without him. And they took us out of the scanning room, into a more quiet room while they typed up the report. Wed like to set additional cookies to understand how you use GOV.UK, remember your settings and improve government services. But you know I knew we had, we had to make a decision that was right for the baby as well. I could hardly breathe. This time, they discovered the baby has a two vessel cord (only one vessel from placenta to baby instead of two) and I've been monitored to make sure the baby grows properly and kidneys aren't damaged. And with each one we had to have the same conversations. He started to scan me with a cold expression, then told me, "it didn't look good" and that "my womb looked raggedy". Everywhere you look, there are happy, fat, smug pregnant women. That was an extremely difficult day. We didn't name him. The first midwife seemed to understand what we were trying to say, and said she would ask the doctor to come and talk to us. He sounded like a wild animal in pain, deep pain. There is always a chance that a baby may be born with a health issue that scans could not have identified. He started to scan me with a cold expression, then told me, 'it didn't look good' and that 'my womb looked raggedy'. 13/12/2020 20:45. It is essential that all practitioners performing fetal anomaly ultrasound screening should be trained to communicate abnormal findings to women, as such information is likely to have significant emotional impact. The people who did know what was going on seemed far too sure that we were doing the right thing, that there was really no choice to be made. I faced another internal scan where I began to feel helpless and alone. Some parents wondered if it was possible to have the same scan done at 16 weeks rather than 20 weeks. And nothing prepares you at all. I had no issues at my 20wk scan with DD - and neither did any of my antenatal group (9 mums). factor is very strong. It was a bit worrying but on the plus side I got an extra couple of scans and an extra couple of pictures. The doctor gave her consent, and I took the four little tablets. I know I could have delivered him in a quarter of the time, but I couldn't bear the thought of him leaving me. Did you, how did that scan make you feel? The gel makes sure there is good contact between the probe and your skin. I know its hard- but i really wouldnt worry about it too much as the worry will stress you and your body out. The appointment usually takes around 30 minutes. Mumsnet carries some affiliate marketing links, so if you buy something through our posts, we may get a small share of the sale (more details here), tbh, they never give you good news at scans. If you choose not to have the scan you can still have all other parts of your routine antenatal care. I've realised that being a nice person is a luxury some can't afford. 12/12/2012 22:41. So we went home, me to rest in an attempt to prevent miscarriage, my partner to reassure us both. A company limited by guarantee registered in England and Wales company number 3266897. He felt doing more blood tests would only cause me more discomfort and false hope. What were babys measurements at 20 week scan? The hardest thing I have ever done. So choroid plexus cysts on their own, no problem, but if there's something else wrong, then that's a problem. (See 'Resources'). But that was too easy. It's quite common, perhaps 1 in 10 they find these, and within a few weeks they disappear. It feels very lonely and isolating. I am a darker, harder version of myself. It was probably all right but hadn't had any fluid in it at the moment. For example, the babys brain, kidneys, internal organs or bones may not have developed properly. Instinctively, did it feel right? At first, I still had to deal with the physical implications of having given birth. My wife had been very, very healthy, more healthy than the first pregnancy, and of course was shattered by the fact that the news, the news was appalling, very serious faces. It's been a heartbreaking nightmare. I had to wait for a doctor to explain the situation. I didn't sleep that night I don't think. It seemed inconceivable that we would not be having a baby in May. There was complete silence during the scan. Nights were impossible. Last updated July 2017. After that I got, I, it was about in, in 19-, hang on a minute, 2001 I got pregnant again, slightly unexpectedly. I was experiencing some light bleeding for the past few days. I agreed to an internal scan as the sonographer said we could get a better picture of what was happening. The scan can provide information that may mean you have to make further, important decisions.