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Houzz utilise des cookies et d'autres technologies de suivi similaires pour personnaliser mon exprience utilisateur, me proposer du contenu pertinent et amliorer ses produits et services. Too little, and the kerdi will never show you gray, no matter how you sweat. While cement board and grout are not waterproof, Kerdi is and can even be directly installed over drywall. builder, anti-builder, rebuilder -- Retired Moderator. Fiber cement board is a variation of cement board that is made from compressed cement and sand and reinforced with wood fibers throughout. And by 'booking the Kerdi' I mean we put it in the bathtub, sprayed it with the handshower, then booked it (just like wallpaper). There is definitely skill & planning required to doit right. Once this is done, continue the installation by following the directions for the particular Kerdi product being used. I used to "trust" the Kerdi and drywall until I had a shower that the valve broke inside the wall cavity four years after being put in. Cement board is readily available and relatively inexpensive (about $10 for a 3 x 5-ft. sheet). An extra layer of thinset is then added to the surface of the cement board to adhere the tiles in place. The manual can be found here: http://floorelf.com/waterproof, I would say unless you are experienced in working with Schluter-Kerdi waterproofing membrane kit, then I would say work with an easier waterproofing approach, either liquid waterproofing or a combination of liquid and traditional waterproofing (plastic covering the wood frame). You still use metal lath, but then mix bags of powder and pour the soupy mix onto the floor. The core isnt waterproof, but it can withstand getting wet without falling apart, so even if your waterproofing system leaks, the board will stay intact. What can a lawyer do if the client wants him to be acquitted of everything despite serious evidence? Cement board is a mineral-based board, usually 30 inches by 60 inches, that is used as a lower, dimensionally stable surface for installing ceramic tile, porcelain tile, or stonework. (3ft-3in wide). Will be doing a bathroom gut and will be laying durock cement board over plywood sub floor. When doing so, it is important to ensure that the drywall surface is clean and free of dust, grease, and loose paint. Cement board is typically used in wet areas, such as bathrooms and areas with a lot of moisture, because it is waterproof and provides a level of protection from water damage and long-term moisture exposure. Finally, use a roller or brush to ensure that the membrane is secure and has no wrinkles or air bubbles. DIYers on this forum seem to have nothing but problems with Hardi. Also, apply the acrylic mastic between the Create curved designs around pipes or columns using the vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or use L-shaped KERDI-BOARD-E panels to enclose similar. Overall, waterproofing behind and around shower tile is a critical part of any installation to ensure that the area is adequately protected from water and moisture damage. Shouldn't take too long, maybe an hour or so. Seems like I've been using the full measure of water the bag calls for, plus about 10%.-50 lbs of thinset at a time is too much for an amatuer. Without an underlayment, even the slightest movement of the subfloor can result in cracking of the tile and crumbling of the grout lines. Hi David. #2 - Your suggestion has plenty of merit though. About an argument in Famine, Affluence and Morality, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. This is the traditional tile backer. Overall, putting Kerdi over regular drywall can be done, with the proper steps in place to properly install the membrane and its components. These multifunctional tile substrate and building panels are thus perfect for creating bonded waterproofing assemblies with tile coverings. When I tried to use the edge of my trowel [per schlutter video] I could see I was pulling a lot of the 'felt' off the backer. Applying a conventional cement backer board to such a structure is almost impossible. And for a more secure fit, you can also use screws. With so many different types of underlayment to choose from, it can be hard to decide which is best for your project. In normal residential use I wouldn't worry about it. That was not a fault of the Kerdi, or the installation. I would avoid Hardi, as Avanti is right that it is thirsty. Send us an email: , What type of thin-set mortar should I use when installing Schluter, Using a Prefabricated Shower Tray and Ramp. What I would be most scared off is the fact that no inside or outside corners appear to have been used. . Re: Kerdi on shower curbs. Waterproof showers are the trend today, so RedGard is an excellent alternative to cement boards that act as vapor barriers. In order to determine which tile underlayment is right for your project, you need to know which issue youre trying to solve whether its preventing subfloor cracks from transferring to the tile, soundproofing, moisture protection, or providing more rigidity to the tile. It is also widely available and a relatively inexpensive option approximately $10 for a 3-foot by 5-foot sheet. Furthermore, if you're working in an older home KERDI-BOARD fits better than cement board in odd spaces. ), Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain, Finite abelian groups with fewer automorphisms than a subgroup. Greenboard is the same as regular drywall. Will be replacing tub shower combination with tiled shower in my home. Kerdi's systems are fairly reputable. Our thinset was more watery than the videos, but it still managed to dry out quickly, even in the time it takes to apply the small corners in our shampoo niche. How do I connect these two faces together? I think it is engrained in me to do that so I forget to mention it. I used this to seal a 3 1/2 by 6 1/2 foot shower with 7 foot walls. We think it is the cement board (Durock) sucking the moisture out of the unmodified thinset. GoBoard is a kind of backer board because the main elements of a backer board are cement, silica, fiberglass, etc. Kerdi membrane is a waterproofing material that is designed to be used in wet areas such as bathrooms and showers before tiles are installed. Thanks to all for the feedback. Yes, it is possible to put Kerdi over regular drywall. We think it is the cement board (Durock) sucking the moisture out of the unmodified thinset. craft paper or plastic is great if the inspector wants it but it is (should be) doing nothing for a tub surround that has HB/redgard/thinset/tile. Any competent tile contractor would float the wall in mortar giving you a stronger, level, perfectly flat, and square surface to properly install tile. It is important to seal any imperfections in the drywall to ensure a long-lasting installation and to minimize water infiltration. Home Improvement Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for contractors and serious DIYers. Houzz Pro: One simple solution for contractors and design pros, surfer thanked Avanti Tile & Stone / Stonetech. First, it's super lightweight compared with the rest. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? "thanks in advance :-) I know so little about this stuff, but when I watch videos (made by schluter-kerdi) everything looks so tidy and perfect - maybe that's not realistic'''" - Lisa Jasper It should look better than that and it's hard to tell but the wall stud spacing looks extreme and more than 16" I could not see if the screw heads where covered in the photos and in the one picture you can see that the screw and washer fitting where not covered. Bulk update symbol size units from mm to map units in rule-based symbology. Your email address will not be published. Yes, KERDI membrane will stick to cement board. Kerdi Board panels have a number of other advantages: they can be cut to size using an ordinary utility knife, can be glued or screwed into place, and are very lightweight. Unlike cement boards, you can bend this material without it breaking. We installed cement board on the walls, and today when we attempted to apply the Kerdi membrane we could not get it to adhere. I have watched it done 10-15 times, have good skills, and if I tried to make large mortar walls myself it might like a little kid threw up concrete Should I use Kerdi membrane or cement backerboard? This makes Kerdi Board suitable for a wide variety of interior applications, including kitchen countertops. Mike Holmes uses backer on his show. Kerdi can be installed first on drywall or cement board. One of the company says they are going to apply kerdi membrane on the drywall, then tiles onto the kerdi membrane, and as such as cement backboard would not be required. We don't expect people to master this and in fact I know maybe two guys in my area (live in big city) that could do this. However, you do still have to take care to waterproof the seams and the fastener penetrations to create a waterproof assembly. 120 sq feet including the floor. Thinset with a latex acrylic modifier is best for interior projects, but if youre installing outdoors, you should use thinset with a polymer modified (PM) compound for greater moisture resistance. Both may be effective substrates, but Kerdi Board boasts significant advantages. Kerdi Board is suitable for a number of interior applications. there should be a small gap between the backer board and the tub. But I did want to understand the cost breakdown as the walls then become WAY more expensive than it would be with Redguard. Schluter says that the Kerdi membrane and tile can be installed over standard gypsum wall board without any problems. This will help to ensure that all drywall is completely covered. Start by cleaning the cement board with a mineral oil soap; this will help reduce mold and mildew growth throughout the life of the shower. Sledge hammers for the floor, that might take a bit of time. Cement board is particularly vulnerable to water damage, so waterproofing can help protect it and help it last longer. #3 This is a DIY site. A complete schluter shower kit is like $700-$900 depending on the size - this includes the pitched foam shower pan. Actually if you watch any pros work (not on crappy shows) on TV you will see them use backer board 99% of the time. Your air bubbles will travel along the valleys you've made, and it's way better if you only have to move them 20 inches to the nearest edge rather than all the way from the ceiling to the floor [Again, Mongo can, but he has mad skills].-Not paying attention to the principle of bedding top down, center out. Cement board (cbu) is not waterproof, but is not damaged by being wet. The Schlter system tends to be more durable than a cement board, but it also depends on the particular application and the weather. I can take a bit of it off the wall and roll it into a ball. Cement board is a bit better, but you need to spray either one before applying the mortar so that it doesn't "skin over" before you can get the Kerdi up. Building Panel: Price $ 119 00 $ 202 06 $ 279 00. Yes, you should prime drywall before installing KERDI in order to ensure proper adhesion and a successful installation. you should still water proof with a liquid membrane product like RedGuard. tripadvisor car rental tampa airport xnxx big tits; roommate questionnaire google form shadow of the dragon queen deluxe; cities where home prices are rising 2022 beachbody bodi block; mahogany tree seeds uses You just need a hammer and wonderbar for the walls. Is a PhD visitor considered as a visiting scholar? Once the wall is prepped, use a primer that is compatible with the KERDI membrane so that it will properly adhere to the wall. The cement board core itself is not waterproof, but it can withstand water without falling apart. I would fear leaks in all corners of this shower. Go with smaller bags or only mix half. The perfect fold is tricky and many of my first steam showers where built without the sealed slip joint. I would get someone else. All shower/tub areas should have concrete board (I prefer hardiboard). For the floor, he should've put a mortar bed, then a membrane that goes over the curb, then another mortar bed. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. . Are there tables of wastage rates for different fruit and veg? Ideally the DalSeal TS would fold into the gap between the wall and ceiling concrete board. There's a really great manual (with diagrams) that makes this all easier to understand. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[728,90],'remodelormove_com-mobile-leaderboard-1','ezslot_24',166,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-mobile-leaderboard-1-0');If cement board is not waterproof, it can negatively impact the integrity of the tile that is installed on top of it, and can lead to a variety of issues. Also are you saying that you wet ("booking the Kerdi") the Kerdi, as well? Can be cut to size easily using a utility knife. Will add it in. All it takes is the right preparation. Install the drain adapter, if needed. When installing Schluter Kerdi Membrane over cement backerboard: Should I use Alkali Resistant Mesh Tape and thinset on the seams of the backer board (for long term durability to prevent each board moving independently thus preventing cracking) prior to installing the Kerdi membrane. In . He would take his rough opening measurement and subtract the thicknesses of the tile, the cement board, and in his unique install method the purpleboard. Prime first to create a flat, uniform surface that is free of dust, grease and other debris. I have corrugated metal shower surround & grab bars. The benefit of using kerdi is we can lay it over drywall, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup. Removing bathroom tile from cement backerboard, Transition from KERDI membrane backed, to not backed. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? . There is no cutting or fitting of boards, and a mortar bed is good for leveling and flattening uneven or out-of-level floors, which are common in old houses. The grid lines on the surface are incredibly helpful for installation and making neat cuts. 173 upvotes. When it comes to installation, a Schlter system is typically easier to install than a cement board, and it also allows for more design freedom as it does not require a traditional waterproof layer. It's a lightweight polystyrene board faced with Kerdi that comes in various thicknesses that you can use in place of drywall or cement board. @JimmyFix-it - hardiboard is not really porous unless it is completely saturated. Why is there a voltage on my HDMI and coaxial cables? As a contractor, I have been using Kerdi since it came out. Moisture resistant can cause similar problems, and there is absolutely no advantage to it. It allows you to easily and quickly create tile-ready elements in bathtub surrounds and platforms, vanities, showers, shelving, and much more. Allow the adhesive to cure for the amount of time recommended by the adhesives manufacturer. Tile Shower SurroundCement Backerboard Location? What are the differences between "paperless drywall" and "cement board"? Well, DH said he had virtually no time to work with the stuff before it dried out, so he switched from my spritz bottle to a sponge. Need help liner vs liquid membrane question. Following these steps will help ensure that your shower space is properly sealed, and thus that the cement board is well protected from moisture. Install the Schluter Kerdi membrane over the backer board using the correct mortar. Step 1: Measure the area. Sure, you can do it.just be sure to "spritz" or wet the hardi thoroughly before.it's pretty "thirsty.". #4 You could be adding a good 1000 pounds to your install too. 1. While cement board is a reliable tile underlayment, it isnt completely waterproof only water-resistant. vegan) just to try it, does this inconvenience the caterers and staff? Step 3: Apply Thinset. is that because water doesn't really hit that area?" - Lisa Jasper That's pushing it but should be fine. The tub flange can really be a pain in the butt when installing a tile tub surround. Firstly, it is important to ensure the wall is adequately prepared and that it is smooth, flat and free of defects. It looks like Kerdi membrane is ~$2/sqft ($200 for a 108sqft roll) and kerdi board is $3.7/sqft ($115 for a 4x8 sheet (Lowes)). Needed to interject a little "amateur humor. The Kerdi-Line prefab pans and drains make me feel way more comfortable with the waterproofing. If you want to go to the extra effort of putting the membrane over drywall, there is no need to use greenboard. We store towels, medicine, toiletry supplies, first-aid gear, massage devices, facial steamers, spare Painting your garage is a great way to improve the look of the space and make the walls easier to clean. Schluter says that the Kerdi membrane and tile can be installed over standard gypsum wall board without any problems. x 33 ft. Waterproofing Membrane: Kerdi-Board 1/2 in. Most cement-based thin-set mortars are suitable; however, it is important to check the manufacturers instructions to ensure that the product is approved for use with Schluter systems. Using cement board and a sheet membrane . The cement board can also become weakened and start to flake away when it absorbs moisture, causing ugly spots and patches to start appearing on the wall. The use of modified thinset adhesive could result in an inadequate bond and could lead to possible delamination. That would tell him where the edge of the framing needs to be. I'm guessing he put a 2x6 across for the curb? ), Schluter SET, ALL-SET, FAST-SET or an unmodified thin-set mortar is recommended. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. This is a bit difficult to answer as it depends on the particular application for the floor system. Redgard is a similar product. To properly seal a cement board for a shower, its important to first properly prepare the surface. Another advantage is that the polyisocyanurate core of foam boards is waterproof. the cost of the tile job. Kerdi does admit that you can use cement board. I posted a plea for help and Mongo and Bill both gave me good advice. It is important to waterproof Hardie board to make it more water-resistant, as well as to protect the materials from the elements. modified thin-set mortar is not recommended to set ceramic and stone tile, including large format tiles, over the KERDI membrane. Properly waterproofing a shower area sharing a living room wall, Can I use cement accelerator to decrease setup time of modified thinset. Like the example above. Ceramic and porcelain tile, more than almost any other surface material, need a stable . The completed assembly takes the place of more traditional backer board when installed over 3/4-inch wood subfloors. Kerdi Membrane is a product of Schluter systems. Thanks Paul! True cement board (Durck, Wonderboard) is my first choice as a tile or Kerdi backer. It also features fleece webbing that allows for effective anchoring into thin-set mortar. Properly waterproofed Hardie board should last for many years. A quality underlayment will also serve as a waterproof barrier between the subfloor and the tile surface. 4. Putting this stuff on walls is difficult and time . Once the membrane is in place, it can be sealed and reinforced with Kerdi-Fix sealant, Kerdi band, and Kerdi-Drain for added waterproofing strength. New England. Its essential to protect surrounding wall and floor surfaces from water or moisture damage that can occur in these areas. Install an Uncoupling Membrane Between Concrete and Tile. Cement board and grout are not water proof, if there's Kerdi no moisture is ever going to be able to get behind it. With that said, lets take a look at the importance of choosing the right tile substrate, the options you have, and which tile underlayment material you should choose Kerdi Board or cement board? My floor tiles are 2" x 2"." - Lisa Jasper No - you can not use Kerdi Board on the floor. Here is a video off the Schluter-Kerdi website that describes how to apply the waterproof membrane on top of the substrate (gypsum board in this case): http://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/en_US/Shower-System/KERDI-SHOWER-KIT/Schluter%C2%AE-KERDI-SHOWER-KIT/p/KERDI_SHOWER-KIT. Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. This flexible polyethylene layer is easy to install and can protect the tile from both cracking and moisture. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. It works well, is what Schluter recommends and I've never had an issue with it. Is it suspicious or odd to stand by the gate of a GA airport watching the planes? It looks like you have Kerdi installed on the floor and not Kerdi Board. This allows for future compression and an area at the corner where things are more forgiving. The foam core surrounded by synthetic cloth on both sides and adhered with resin glue is. Blocking should be constant across this area when openings are larger than your fist. For all the substrates listed in this Handbook (e.g., gypsum board, cement backerboard, etc. @DMoore- OK, I agree that with redguard it would be redundant. We recommend our users to update the browser. Contact us: 888-472-4588 Calculating probabilities from d6 dice pool (Degenesis rules for botches and triggers). You provide the pitch during the tile set. If you want added info there's an old Kerdi thread here. It only takes a minute to sign up. It is lightweight and made of expanded polystyrene. All it takes is the right preparation. Installation is simple- just trowel a layer of thin-set adhesive on the floor and embed the mat in it, then fill the cavities with thin-set. They are designed to provide a waterproof, vapor-tight layer to the substrate, which in this case would be the cement board. Modified thin-set mortars must dry for the polymers to coalesce and form a hard . It only takes a minute to sign up. Can I install Kerdi board just on the walls of my shower and use a PVC membrane on the floor? Cement board is a heavy mess compared to drywall, and drywall is a heavy mess compared to Kerdi Board. While cement board may be the most common and widely-known tile substrate, Kerdi Board is giving it a run for its money. Out of curiosity, why are any of you suggesting backerboard at all? Once its cleaned, use caulk to seal all of the seams where the cement board meets the walls. It also helped me to work in smaller sheets. If so, that means breaking up the floor pan. This allows the cement to properly hydrate, resulting in a strong, dense bond coat. We apply the thinset the recommended trowel, can't remember what size off the top of my head, in small sections and by the time my husband hands my the piece of membrane the thinset is not skinned over but certainly dry. I also used a larger sized trowel than the one recommend by Schluter. For the floor I make a dry mix mud base and then the Kerdi membrane. Significantly more time and effort is required to ensure a quality bond when using a modified thinset adhesive with KERDI, and for this reason, it is usually not recommended. The drywall's back side fails, and it's just as bad or worse than it was on the tile side. When applying thin-set mortar, the manufacturers instructions should be followed closely. I have to redo my tub surround due to moisture leaks and failing grout. How should I transition between cement board floor and alcove tub? To line niche shelves, for instance. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Should I redo this wall to avoid a mold sandwich? 3. A.Sean Gerolimatos, technical services manager for Schluter Systems, responds: With a few exceptions, unmodified thinset mortar is required for setting ceramic and stone tile over Kerdi membranes (800/472-4588, www.schluter.com ), as well as for bonding overlapped seams and connections to Kerdi drains. Though, each product comes with its own individual characteristics, and pros and cons. A place where magic is studied and practiced? Manufactured by Schluter Systems, Kerdi Board is a multifunctional tile underlayment and construction panel, that can also be implemented for forming bonded waterproof assemblies with tile coverings. Its important to note that Kerdi membrane is not a structural base layer, so plywood should be installed and reinforced as necessary based on load requirements. Whether or not you need a Kerdi membrane is a factor of use. It is designed to form a waterproof layer between cement board and tiles, helping create a watertight installation. I barely touch it with my hands before going to the tape knife. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. Fixing that is not that easy though. A successful tile installation largely depends on the substrate that the tile is attached to. When it comes to tile underlayment, your options can be categorized into three main classifications, each suitable for different tiling circumstances: Although cement board is the most commonly used underlayment for tile, Kerdi board is growing in popularity as a multifunctional tile substrate. ! Gettin' a little delirious. Water-resistant gypsum board, or green board, was used in the past as a tile backer but is no longer recommended, mainly because better products are available. I've never had a failure. Is it ok to fasten a shower surround to Schluter Kerdi curb? You can apply it on PVC, metal, slabs, walls, and floors. PROBLEM SOLVED for Tub Flange when Installing Cement Board and Tile. Kerdi 3 ft. 3 in. Builder saying he doesn't want to put my trim tile in here. Once all that is completed and the Aquadefense has dried, you can install your tile with a polymer modified mortar meeting the ANSI requirements of A118.4 or A118.11. Sweeby-Can you clarify- I undestood that the thinset would tend to dry out from the thirsty hardi or skim over from the air; so how does booking the Kerdi help with the first? What to use to flatten and prep wall before installing Schluter Kerdi membrane for tiling? If done according to manufacturers instructions, it will seal nicely. Following the instructions for the product being used and ensuring that all of the necessary steps are followed will help to ensure a successful installation. They can be installed on any type of support and can even be used to create partitions, with no structural support required. ps, now that you don't need it anymore you can throw that useless cheap piece of crap magnesium float my way. Everyone knows brick and stucco, but what about fiber cement and metal? 120 sq feet including the floor. This is a very effective and popular method of installing tile, and one that ensures the tile doesnt crack. Will use the Schluter Shower system. Why does the plumbing rough need to be moved? Set ceramic and stone tile over the KERDI membrane with unmodified thin-set mortar, including large format tiles. Rolling pin, good, now I can throw away my magnesium float.LOLCasey. Yes. Let's start! Additionally, seal the space around any pipes and fixtures that can be found in the shower. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search.